Given that a mile is just a little over 5000 feet (by 280), maybe smaller increments would attract more attention. Pretty good idea actually, and an annual (or bi-monthly) updated column/artcle in your magazine would encourage folks to participate and document the event. Getting it up there isn't as hard as getting it back in one piece to repeat the feat. Once isn't enough - second time's the proof. Just my spin on it.

hmm... I've thought about this a bit. I think I'd like to keep it at 10k feet (2 miles). I think this is a good starting number for two reasons... first, its a moderately difficult altitude to obtain in that it can be done, but requires some effort and second that it allows for the word 'extreme' to have some application. if it were 1,000 feet or 5,000 feet its not quite so extreme.

currently my highest flight is 8,800 feet, so I'd be going after the 10k club myself and it gives me something to strive for this summer.

Good point Brent, I would definitely participate, I think that if you can get a few people going (sounds like many in NCR will participate) then you will get a lot, good plan. I have been meaning to talk with you about it for a while, glad you brought it up!

Interactive avenues are important!

Art

Except for the cost of creating the different logos and having to stock the different shirts or stickers or coffee cups or whatever.

Warren

Kimberly's idea is to use one of these services where you submit the artwork, and then anyone can buy cups, tshirts or whatever they want with the logo on it. so, I wouldn't really be stocking anything for this. maybe might do stickers for people to put on rockets for each bracket they are in.

Ah, like Cafe Press.

W

This does sound kind of cool. Now for that 20K thing.

What about a pin like Rocket Silo had for L1-3?

I to would be quite Interested... I do have to agree with JW... 10K is a good accomplishment. I have gotten for myself to the point where most my flights are past that. 15K is quite a bit more of a challenge. Im off by just a few feet. Currently Im working on a project that with the right motor combo and as long as I get my weight and length where I want it should be quite capable of 30 to 35K maybe more. But I plan to roll on it gradually to get my "clean recovery" down.. Again another thing I agree with JW on. But for what you want Brent it may not be necessary.. Oh yea. I also like the idea of it being commercial or research.... especially beings about all I do anymore is homebrew...

Conway

This does sound kind of cool. Now for that 20K thing.

What about a pin like Rocket Silo had for L1-3?

The rocketsilo pins were produced by one of my employees back in vegas who now has his own pin company. unfortunately the costs for these things are slightly high... I think maybe it would be best to get a few dozen folks listed and involved before I sink a bunch of money into pins. but, that said, the pins are a great idea and I think they would go over really well.

hmm... that said, maybe I should look into the L1,L2,L3 pins since rocketsilo isn't making them anymore.

Brent, I'm the kind of guy who needs a challenge or goal to shoot for, so please keep the program going.

You might want to consider metrifying the levels to be more in tune with units used in the space programs, and being a differentiator from the mile-hi club, while providing a few more plateaus in 1 kilometer increments. My Suggestion for "Extreme Rocketry Killer (of) Kilometers" , would be that rocketeers could collect "Kil's" and be awarded an ER logo decal (see example below) for their rocket or truck. 5 Kil's make you an "Ace". Rockets would display their kil's on the airframe (a 2" diameter decal would fit most any size HP rocket) at launches. Good advertising for you. You would just need one basic decal, and a strip of numbers to place on the decal.

1 km = 3280 ft
2 km = 6562 ft
3 km = 9843 ft
4 km = 13124 ft
5 km = 16404 ft (ACE)
6 km = 19685 ft
7 km = 22966 ft
8 km = 26247 ft
9 km = 29528 ft
10 km = 32808 ft

My L1 gave me my first "Kil". 😀 My L2 fell short by a hundred feet. 😳
FYI, when I was in Vietnam "Clicks" were used to denote a Kilometer (and still are).

This would be a lot easier to handle than T-Shirts (which could then be available for purchase later - consider iron-on decals as well), would increase the number of participants generating traffic, and for the cost of a stamp and a decal, can be sent out to participants.

This coming from a veteran of Robot Wars and BattleBots... I can see it now, Rocket Rage or Altitude Wars or something... Actually a pretty funny image - rockets flying to extreme altitude and deploying carbide saws or big hammers to knock down the competition... It would make a good cartoon for sure. I sure enjoyed the hell out of watching those shows on TV and admire the hell out of the effort to build those 'bots - especially the super-heavyweights.

I'm not so sure about metric. Even numbers like 10K, 15K, 20K, 25K, etc. all seem more "natural" to me, and more spread out not to mention higher than 1Kilometer, 2 Kilometer, etc. How many divisions should there be? After 25K' AGL, I don't think I'd give awards for every 5K', but go to 10K' divisions - after 50K', I think I'd just drop to 25K' divisions up to 100K. Above a 100K, I'd maybe drop to 50K' divisions or even 100K' divisions. After all, with Gene Novaczyk and friends talking about sub-orbital flights to over 320K', that's certainly in the offing for the hobby.

Warren

Brent, I'm the kind of guy who needs a challenge or goal to shoot for, so please keep the program going.

You might want to consider metrifying the levels to be more in tune with units used in the space programs, and being a differentiator from the mile-hi club, while providing a few more plateaus in 1 kilometer increments. My Suggestion for "Extreme Rocketry Killer (of) Kilometers" , would be that rocketeers could collect "Kil's" and be awarded an ER logo decal (see example below) for their rocket or truck. 5 Kil's make you an "Ace". Rockets would display their kil's on the airframe (a 2" diameter decal would fit most any size HP rocket) at launches. Good advertising for you.

1 km = 3280 ft
2 km = 6562 ft
3 km = 9843 ft
4 km = 13124 ft
5 km = 16404 ft (ACE)
6 km = 19685 ft
7 km = 22966 ft
8 km = 26247 ft
9 km = 29528 ft
10 km = 32808 ft

My L1 gave me my first "Kil". 😀 My L2 fell short by a hundred feet. 😳
FYI, when I was in Vietnam "Clicks" were used to denote a Kilometer (and still are).

This would be a lot easier to handle than T-Shirts (which could then be available for purchase later - consider iron-on decals as well), would increase the number of participants generating traffic, and for the cost of a stamp and a decal, can be sent out to participants.

SOO--- Mike, You didnt really put much thought into it, did you. 😉
Jeese man, nest time I need some logo work done I'll call you! 😯
I think you still need some more work though, to sell Warren on those
Kilo-thingys. 🙂

Hey this is the US - if we want to be primitive and be the only country on the planet that uses old Imperial measurements like Miles, Gallons, Quarts, we can damn well do it. After all, we've got the largest military in the world and a defense budget larger than the defense budgets of EVERY OTHER COUNTRY ON THE PLANET all added together! We can do what we want dammit!.

W

Brent, either way is fine. This is a wonderful idea. Warren, I remember heading off to college in 1971, and our country was all stoked to go metric, a base 10 system is simple. Why is it that even the English don't use the English system anymore? 🙄

Hey this is the US - if we want to be primitive and be the only country on the planet that uses old Imperial measurements like Miles, Gallons, Quarts, we can damn well do it. After all, we've got the largest military in the world and a defense budget larger than the defense budgets of EVERY OTHER COUNTRY ON THE PLANET all added together! We can do what we want dammit!.

W

AAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!!!!

Did I mention my comments were tongue in cheek?

W

Actually Im all, for the English measuring system myself.. Fist off Altimeters beep out the feet of altitude. Not the metric equivalent.

Keep it simple.. People here know the English system. Not the metric. Its what we still use for the standard today in the US.

Also the contest is about Extreme is it not? Now not that 10K is the MOST amazing feat. But to break it is an accomplishment and one of the hardest first altitude barriers one does.. Kinda like the starting point.. After that increments in 5 K would be best. Dont make it jump around when you get to 20 or 25K. So if you say at 20k and go to 30k a person does 25 or 26K isn't enough of a feat to recognize? I disagree with varying the amount. What about a guy that does 65K.. Is he only going to qualify for a 50K flight... No.. He should get 65K. If we aren't going to recognize the 15k difference in altitude of a 65k flight, why would we even recognize a 10K or a 15K flight to begin with..

Instead of making it actual set limits. Why not do different groups.. Like the 10 to 20K an so on. They get to claim their actual altitude. Hey when you do a TRA record they dont round it down or up. Its what it is..

But thats just my 2c on that.

Some info by the way..

motor classes that can achieve altitudes

H motors can push up to 10K
I motors can push up to 14K
J motors can push up to 19k (almost 20)
K motors can push up to 28k
L motors can push up to 31k
M motors can push up to 35 to 40k
N motors can push up to 40 to 45k
O motors can push up to 40 to 50k
P motors can push up to 60 to 75k
Q can push up to 100k+
and so on...

Now for those that are going past 100K..... Come on. Lets get real here. Is it privately funded? Built and paid for by just the person themself. I really hate to say it but when does it become a issue of nothing more the deep pockets vs complete skill and talent.. Look at Tony.. he doesn't have TONS of money invested in fact quite the opposite. but makes an M motor do 35K. with clean recovery. Thats skills!!

I have respect for guys Like Gene Novaczyk and what he has done so far, But its one thing to talk about putting one up to 320K' and actually doing it..

Darren Wright and Jeff Taylor worked with a college group to pump one up there past 250K and I can tell you its no small feat. They had to splash it. It was launched from a NASA site. It was a high dollar deal and funded by the school.

I think we need to look to the hobbyist. Not forget them as they are who reads the magazine as well as will be striving to do their best.. Just average every day folks.. Of course I may be all wrong here and blowing smoke out my butt...

😯

Conway

lots of great feedback here! thanks so much for the input.

I think I was sticking with feet for altitude mostly because its what altimeters kick out and I believe it the standard used by both Tripoli and NAR. I'm just being a bit of a sheep here LOL.

the brackets are set up with some room to grow. I'm guessing most folks will be like myself and maybe make the 10k or 20k brackets this decade... maybe between 2020 and 30 I'll be seeing higher altitudes... who knows?

I'll work over the next couple months to get my website and promos going on this so that by april or so I'll be prepared for the bulk of the US flying season.