Bruce, Thanks again for the thankless job.
It was close after all. That e B/g stole the show from this end, wonder what they know we dont? 😆
JS

We'll see, won't we? 🙂 I'm thinking about upscaling my NARAM-11 Sparrow (B or C--don't remember) BG for an E... 1/16" balsa wood to... ? 😉

We'll see, won't we? 🙂 I'm thinking about upscaling my NARAM-11 Sparrow (B or C--don't remember) BG for an E... 1/16" balsa wood to... ? 😉

My thoughts are to use pre-fabbed foam core wing and whatever, exotic ply, balsa, CF,--add spars? This has me stewing. I'm thinking basically a CF tube tail fuse,, maybe build around some soluble foam for the front fuze with tri-ax CF.
JS

to foam and whatever, exotic ply, balsa, CF,--add spars? This has me stewing. I'm thinking basically a CF tube tail fuse,, maybe build around some soluble foam for the front fuze with tri-ax CF.
JS

Now I'm stewing, stainless steel and a good ol' Colorado thermal! 😈

Bruce,

Have you ever looked at the FAI hand launched designs. Amazing what these can do on a toss--actually more akin to a discus throw in some cases, but man can those model airplane guys build. 2 minutes or more on a hand toss? 😳 Thats just good ole slab balsa construction.
JS

Thats just good ole slab balsa construction.
JS

I've seen videos of those guys, and their work is amazing. But since we're dealing with E impulse... I was going to joke about glassing balsa wood... hmmm... I know I'll use a Manta design, just not sure at this point what it's going to be made of. Not much time to build and test. There are a hell of a lot more variables to consider with gliders than altitude... I've got to think about this... 😕

Hey Guys (& Gals?)

I just recently joined this site 'cuz I was interested in what contests a BAR and sons might enter at MHM07, among other things. Since I noticed some comments about 'future rocketeers', I'll add my two cents since I fall into that category.
I got back into the hobby when my kidz were old enough to appreciate building as well as flying rockets, and I immediately got "stubby fever" followed shortly by "super-roc madness". Eventually I ended up thinking it would be neat to do NARTREK, so then I naturally ended up here looking for competitions to fly my Bronze rockets in.
I may be poking at the wrong club here, but from up here in Nederland NCR seems like a more pleasant drive and better launch site than CRASH. Also MHM and Oktoberfest seem to be the big local events, so I had to wonder how much black powder you fly.
As a blue-collar BAR w/ kidz, I'd like to see them be able to launch their small blackpowder (read: AFFORDABLE) rockets right alongside Level 3 flights, dreaming of flying an "n" themselves one day. I'd like to see them be able to compete right alongside the "big guys" in some of those black powder events. I'd like them to feel like they have a chance. It'd also be good to have some kid-only events.
As a BAR dad, I'd love to get my HPR certs, but I'd rather spread the available funds around on cheaper rockets for the whole family than get that LOC V-2 that I really MUST HAVE!! And I'd like to fly them competitively too, and I'd like to use them for NARTREK & Cadet, and maybe to get 'NAR points' (which I know little about as yet).

So the short of of my point is this: 'budget' black powder events that everyone can participate in, plus SSS and Mile High type events for the motivated and financed (& the crowd!), and last I suggest events based around rockets built for NARTREK which gives us another reason to join NAR (& NCR) and do NARTREK. Who couldn't afford a couple B PD/SD rockets? On the other hand, I'll have to get the kidz to panhandle on the Pearl Street Mall for mad motor money!

One way or another, I'll see you at MHM with my Scott Towel Specials!

Mark Palmer
Nederland ("Hey I live higher than most of your rockets fly!" [well, maybe not at NCR...])

P.S. We're talking about possibly bringing a Middle School Rocket Club field trip to MHM. Anyone with input on that could email me direct at:
boarhog@infionline.net
thanks

I'd like to see them be able to launch their small blackpowder (read: AFFORDABLE) rockets right alongside Level 3 flights, dreaming of flying an "n" themselves one day.

You've joined the right club. We do it all. The Estes pad (affordable) gets as much use as the high power pads during a launch. We have that NAR Open launch coming up in June, and that's for all ages--a way, if you're NAR, to get those contest points. 8)

8) Borhog, Welcome to NCR. I think you will find every type of flyer in this club. And the kids are more than welcome, in fact we want you to bring your kids and anybody elses you can cram in your car. More the better. At MHM Sara and I will hold a free kids raffle. We have been kicking around some free kids contests. After we get through June, we will get something together. Welcome aboard! 8)

Couple things from a new BAR:

I haven't digested all the NAR rules yet, but it seems to me that there should be contests for each division so that folks compete against their peers. How can a Div A kid really expect to compete against someone with even a Level 1 cert? Especially when we're talking about an E B/G and an F Super-Roc. Hell, how can I compete, I haven't flown a D motor rocket in almost 30 yrs! Is there a B division for wimps over 18?

Nevertheless, I know I'll have to try an F Super-Roc even though I haven't tested any of my smaller designs yet, and gawd I want to make it a Scott Towel Special (course, I don't think I have 10+ tubes..). As for an E B/G, I remember nothing about glider tech and doubted I could get it together by June (nor can I afford an Arcie). The only glider I ever had was the one on the Estes Orbital Transport, and that thing was a ponderous flyer at best. So I had just about given up on that contest as something beyond my current skills to even build, much less build for competition.

Until I had a wonderful, devious, idea... (heh, heh; 'nuff said)

Let me ask one more thing. In these contests, do we all fly the exact same motor or just the same motor class? For these contests, there could be advantages/disadvantages to 18mm vs 24mm D motors, or 24mm vs 29mm F motors, or blackpowder vs. composites, and I don't have the answers. Do I really need to score an RMS F40W or like to be competitive?
So let me put it out there this way. For the F Super-Roc, would you try to fly an 8' BT50 or plug a 29mm mount into, say, a Fliskits Richter Recker? Why? Also any thoughts on transitioning to a smaller upper BT effects on competitiveness, espescially for D motor and larger Super-Rocs?

I don't expect you guys to give away competitive secrets, but can y'all at least get me pointed straight up? Thanks in advance for your responses, from me and anyone else that uses your advice against you June!

Let me ask one more thing. In these contests, do we all fly the exact same motor or just the same motor class?

In your example, you compete with any F you want. The only difference in using reloads is that you have to have them sealed in original bags and inspected before you load them up. With BP (Estes) motors or RMS reloads... if you compete in the C duration, you can use any C engine you feel might give you the edge. It's about impulse range, not specific motors. And, NAR uses age divisions, so a 7 yearold won't be competing against a 40 yearold. The Pink Book gives the breakdown. As soon as I can, I will get into specifics for each contest event from the Pink Book. Doing my taxes today... and I hate doing taxes.

Couple things from a new BAR:

I haven't digested all the NAR rules yet, but it seems to me that there should be contests for each division so that folks compete against their peers. How can a Div A kid really expect to compete against someone with even a Level 1 cert? Especially when we're talking about an E B/G and an F Super-Roc. Hell, how can I compete, I haven't flown a D motor rocket in almost 30 yrs! Is there a B division for wimps over 18?

Nevertheless, I know I'll have to try an F Super-Roc even though I haven't tested any of my smaller designs yet, and gawd I want to make it a Scott Towel Special (course, I don't think I have 10+ tubes..). As for an E B/G, I remember nothing about glider tech and doubted I could get it together by June (nor can I afford an Arcie). The only glider I ever had was the one on the Estes Orbital Transport, and that thing was a ponderous flyer at best. So I had just about given up on that contest as something beyond my current skills to even build, much less build for competition.

Until I had a wonderful, devious, idea... (heh, heh; 'nuff said)

Let me ask one more thing. In these contests, do we all fly the exact same motor or just the same motor class? For these contests, there could be advantages/disadvantages to 18mm vs 24mm D motors, or 24mm vs 29mm F motors, or blackpowder vs. composites, and I don't have the answers. Do I really need to score an RMS F40W or like to be competitive?
So let me put it out there this way. For the F Super-Roc, would you try to fly an 8' BT50 or plug a 29mm mount into, say, a Fliskits Richter Recker? Why? Also any thoughts on transitioning to a smaller upper BT effects on competitiveness, espescially for D motor and larger Super-Rocs?

I don't expect you guys to give away competitive secrets, but can y'all at least get me pointed straight up? Thanks in advance for your responses, from me and anyone else that uses your advice against you June!

Superroc, esp F and G impulse tends to be a battle between two goals, keeping drag to a minimum while ensuring enuf rigidity that it doesn't fold up on itself. They don't call it supernoodle for nothing. One could use say BT 80 tubing for the entire length and have plenty of stiffness, but on the weight and drag issues, it would hurt. Personally I plan on a stepped approach with small diameter at the top and fatter on the bottom.

I crunched the NAR points, and passed the file on to Joe Hinton, the Contest Director, for his approval. If anyone wants to check it for accuracy, please PM me, and I'll forward the Excel file to you.